Have you read the following article of CNA
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/new.php?n=15950

Will Chris West become a controversial figure within a fringe group of the Church? This is so sad. Hope Dr. Alice von Hildebrand talks with Chris West to really understand his important work...

It is a complete misunderstanding of his mission. I was surprised that in the comments section of this article many support her opinion that Chris West ' vocabulary and his way of approaching this topic totally lacks reverence.”

She adds: 'The intimate sphere “is not a topic of public discussion” but is “extremely serious.”'

How can we talk about the beauties of the Theology of the body and NFP if not by public discussions? What Dr. von Hildebrand (that I deeply respect) things we can reach young people? Theology courses? Using pop-culture reference and a language young can relate with (as Chris West is doing) is key in my opinion.

What do you think?

hrm

Wow, I can not even begin to comment on that article. To me it is quite obvious that she has not even read any of his material.

I can make one observation. It seems to me that she thinks that our sexuality is something that should be "behind closed doors" and not discussed. How is that good for the young adults and teens out there that struggle with their sexuality every day in a society that tells them to "go for it"? The more the truth is hidden from public view, the more people seem to lose sight of what is good.

Wow...just reading this brings to mind a quote (ironically from John Paul II). It's from a homily in 1996, I believe. Please read all of this...it's good stuff!!

"Do not be afraid to go out on the streets and into public places, like the first Apostles who preached Christ and the Good News of salvation in the squares of cities, towns and villages. This is no time to be ashamed of the Gospel (cf. Rom 1:16). It is the time to preach it from the rooftops (cf. Mt 10:27). Do not be afraid to break out of comfortable and routine modes of living, in order to take up the challenge of making Christ known in the modern ``metropolis''. It is you who must ``go out into the byroads'' (Mt 22:9) and invite everyone you meet to the banquet which God has prepared for his people. The Gospel must not be kept hidden because of fear or indifference. It was never meant to be hidden away in private. It has to be put on a stand so that people may see its light and give praise to our heavenly Father (cf. Mt 5:15-16). "

Amen to that!!

I love Christopher West, and I understand that Dr. Von Hildebrand comes off as prudish, but you might understand more of what she's trying to say by reading her works and her husband's very brilliant, "In Defense of Purity."

This criticism runs deeper than a response to the Nightline episode. I only in the last year or two discovered that there are different TOB "camps," each emphasizing different aspects, and coming from different backgrounds. I can't begin to explain it because I myself am just now returning to the sources and examining the differences.

Having said that, I'm extremely grateful for West's popularization of TOB and JP2's works. He stepped in when few had the communications gifts to relate to a wide variety of people, especially youth.

I don't think it's an either/ or between West and the other TOB proponents. I think it's a both/ and with healthy dialogue.

I guess I just don't see the need for them to be criticizing West. I think they should be working together to bring TOB to the pubic.

I don't think they're criticizing West per se, but rather his portrayal of TOB. There's a difference. You probably know as well as any one in the Church that it's easier said than done to work together as one, big happy family. Yes, that's the goal. I agree there needs to be greater unity, but I also think that his critics aren't trying to defame his name, but they are making an effort at fraternal correction (see the recent George Weigel column) and defense of what they see as a more authentic version of TOB.

These people aren't mean naysayers; they are friends of John Paull II, and very venerable teachers in the Church. They've been around a lot longer than West, which doesn't mean they're right and he's wrong, but that perhaps we have something to learn from them.

Again, I don't think they're trying to make this personal against West; it's about his work, and I agree that they could be working together. But who knows? Maybe they've tried that already, and it didn't work. I'm not sure.

As I explained on a different thread, I'm no fan of TOB. That being said, it seems that West makes at least some arguments without basis. Apparently, West stated that "[Hugh] Hefner had a 'yearning,' an 'ache' and a 'longing' for love, union and intimacy." As an attorney, I'd have to question how West would know this. I rather doubt that he had a chat with Hefner; I'm sure such a meeting would've been well-publicized. If he didn't hear such language directly from Hefner, it would indicate that he is making some sort of assumption regarding Hefner. The problem is that -- contrary to West's claims -- it appears that Hefner's yearnings were for sex and profit, not for "love, union, and intimacy." The number of women who Hefner has kept as de facto concubines, coupled with the profits his enterprise has made, indicate a rather different motive than those ascribed to Hefner by West.

Secondly, I do not doubt West's sincerity, but it is appalling that some fans of TOB become defensive when TOB or West are criticized. Simply put, exposing one's ideas to verbal combat will eventually lead to (a) the idea being accepted as mainstream and into the deposit of Catholic thought or (b) the idea being rejected. If West (and TOB in general) are to last, then they must withstand the slings and arrows of intelligent discourse. That is exactly what occurred in the 4th century with the Arian heresy; eventually, the Arians lost but not before great writers and thinkers challenged their beliefs. We have to remember that TOB is rather new when compared to the 2000-year age of the Church. Whether it will ever be accepted within the ordinary magisterium of the Church and require assent of the faithful is still an open question.

This article is very interesting. I believe they are fighting the same fight, to maintain the world God first created while battling the ever-present sin, but they are attempting to do so in two very different fashions mainly because they are "preaching" to two very different crowds.

In my experience, Christopher West has sought to help those affected by the cultural revolution of the late 60 through the present. These are people who are post Vatican 2 council and very much aware of MTV, the Playboy empire etc. In this revolution, as Chris tries to explain, the world realized how much it pined for love. The human version of this was to exploit beauty and love through objectification. he must first relate all humans together before he can pronounce God's will for humanity. In drawing the common connection, everyone is aware of who Hugh Hufner is regardless of your personal affinity for the man, he , Chris, can then go on to explain how this image of beauty and love is a result of the fall of man and can only be rectified by returning to God.

I am a young person. Born in the 80's. I relate very much so to Chris' message because it holds relevance to what I experience everyday in my life battling the evils and temptations presented by pop culture. He shows ways to understand pop culture and it is through understanding first that we can change a situation for the better. Without understanding, nothing will change.

I can also see where Dr. von Hildebrand is coming from. A mature woman, she wants to teach traditional Church Values in a traditional manner. Both of these methods are valid methods. However, both have their time and place. Chris speaks at a lot of retreats for young people, engaged couples, newlyweds, those trying to re-discover their faith. He tailors his message for those groups. In a nationally televised interview should he have tried to be more clear in his assertions of TOB, probably. KNowing that the station would have to edit some parts to fit the time frame and knowing that they were going to want ratings, absolutely. Did he do a bad thing, absolutely not.

Both these individuals are shining examples of Catholicism. Two people we should try to emmulate. Is one right and the other wrong, that is all situational in my opinion.

Playing off what Carlos has already written: theologians need to have intellectual argument to fine tune, nail down, or whatever other metaphor you want to use what is lasting and true and fitting with Catholic & Christian thought from what is not. This is just an example of theologians doing what theologians ought--nothing to get upset about--just an argument between different intellectual schools of thought.

I'm also wondering about this quote; it's so choppy, I wonder if it really captures what Dr. von Hildebrand was trying to say:

“Reverence is the key to purity,” she told CNA.” The intimate sphere “is not a topic of public discussion” but is “extremely serious.”

I guess perhaps the point about reverence for the topic is more understandable if you think of it in relation to reverence for the topic of the Eucharist. If someone made somewhat offhanded, playful remarks about the Eucharist... my feathers would be a little ruffled, no matter what their intentions. Of course, the problem is moving (especially with teens and young people) from a total lack of reverence for sexuality and human love as exemplified by the media toward reverence in which we see each other as the Body of Christ and our union as holy... and how to do that.

I am a big fan of Christopher West, especially how he has taken a complex work like the Theology of the Body (which I am trying to read now, but most of it is way over my head) and translating it for those of us without any philosophical/theological background, and bringing it to the attention of many Catholics who might otherwise have never heard of it. His book, "The Good News About Sex & Marriage" has had a big impact on my own life.

However, I can see Dr. von Hildebrand's point too. There needs to be a balance - bringing the truth of sexuality to the people in general, while not 'cheapening' the message.

And I can't help wondering why when you have such a golden opportunity to bring this message of TOTB to the public, you would choose to dwell on Hugh Hefner.

While I'm not a big fan of you comparing TOB to the Arian heresy, I agree with you that there needs to be intelligent discourse, though always with charity.

LOL! Jessica, I didn't mean to equate the two as theological theories, just point out how it sometimes takes decades or even centuries for the Church to reach a decision about things.

well said! and i hate that this thread is titled "controversy". let's not create drama where there really isn't any.

I haven't read the previous posts, but I thought this link might provide some further grounds for discussion.

http://www.jimmyakin.org/2009/05/christopher-west.html#more

There is also

http://www.tobinstitute.com/announcement.asp?AnnouncementsID=22

I have watched West's dvd on TOTB and read his book "Good News about Sex and Marriage" and I don't think there is any controversy.

that's too bad. i wonder if his talks have changed or did i miss something? i found his allegories to be very traditional...just as the apostles and Jesus preached in their day.